32 replies to this topic

[ds968]

http://www.autotrade...m=1284422864712

I wonder if this data base is updated daily..or at least each week
A few really low mileage ones, as well as a couple of optimistic asking prices , but we covered all that in another thread..

[DaveN]

Not one has a supercharger

[Ryan]

One does in fact have a supercharger. The test mule for 928 inc.

[banditsc]

Which was sold long long ago, but Carl hasn't removed. I'm guessing it's just there for advertising to get people to call.

[lbpesq]

The '93 Cab I bought last month is still up on Autotrader, so I suspect they don't clear it out too often.

Bill

[ds968]

that's not the red cab with the near $ 35k asking price was it ? there was one ( all stock ) a few months ago listed at $ 34,999 , low mileage but I don't recall how many miles.. wish I knew what that one actually sold for, if it did..

[968Syncro]

Ok, had some spare time and interest, here are the stats on this sample. These are updated charts from the ones I sent out about 2.5 years ago here: http://www.968forums...wtopic=5194&hl=

Simple average asking price (Feb. 2008 vs Sep. 2010)
2008: $16,898
2010: $15,429

Simple average on mileage
2008: 76,062
2010: 76,995

Asking price vs. mileage, this one is all of the cars for sale in Feb. 2008 vs Sep. 2010:
 Untitled.jpg   46.81KB   3 downloads

Here is an update on prices for cab vs coupe:
 Untitled2.jpg   35.44KB   1 downloads

Here is an update on price vs year (is skewed by a couple of high priced '92s):
 Untitled3.jpg   24.02KB   0 downloads

Conclusions (my rough suggested conclusions):
- prices are steady, not going up or down. The 2010 examples shows some great values (pink squares below the curve in the $13K-$15k range)
- these cars are not being driven much, mileages aren't going up very much).
- relationship of mileage to price is about the same as before. This suggests that 968 values are still driven by "normal car" attributes, i.e. there isn't really an influence that 968s are so special that mileage becomes a secondary consideration. There is a small suggestion in the data that low mileage cars can be had for less $ in 2010 (may not be statistically significant).
- still no real difference between cap and couple values. The common folklore is that cabs are worth more, but the data for both 2008 and 2010 doesn't support that.
- the year of car has no influence on price.

Other thoughts?

Roland

Here is the data file XLS in case anyone wishes to do more fiddling (or hire me to analyze their business )

 valuation_1009.xls   218.5KB   1 downloads

[ds968]

great stuff Roland , very nice illustration and certainly informative !

[rxter]

Cool stuff Roland.

What's the X-axis on 2nd graph?

General disclaimer on the Autotrader data as a source. You can buy a "until sold" ad, which will inevitably skew the database towards cars that have sold and are still up there. During my recent search a couple were either sold or not really for sale - e.g. "for the right price I'll sell it but I really am not motivated to move it"

And clearly the biggest caveat is that this data reflects asking price, not selling price. Based on what I saw both as a buyer and seller in this market not too long ago is that you can adjust by 20%-25%, pretty much all along the curve.

[968Syncro]

What's the X-axis on 2nd graph?: just a simple count, there were about 35 968s for sale in this sample, sorted by asking price gives that plot of cabs and coupes.

And clearly the biggest caveat is that this data reflects asking price, not selling price. : Absolutely, no question, these are asking prices, many are probably 10-25% over the eventual sales price. (I got mine for 30.7% less than asking price).

I would love to get data about 1. time on the market, and 2. actual sales price.

Would also be interesting to see if features can be correlated to price in some believable way, correcting for mileage: tip vs 6-speed, color, performance parts, car location. etc.

Roland

[ds968]

interesting note about cab vs coupe price delta , or the lack of.. hey, i'd argue that's the way it should be, in fact I'd go as far as stating coupes should go for a lot more than cabs ( and it's not as if I'm biased ) not only are coupes faster, but you'd think Porsche would charge more for the materials used given they actually completed the car by putting a roof on it, ( not to mention the outrageous cost of the rear widow ) as opposed to just leaving it with a fabric cover

oh, it's about market demand... never mind !

[Langley968]

I believe that market demand will be a better and better deal for the cab owners as time goes on (at least for those who are trying to sell them), since an "old" cabriolet will always have a certain "charm". As far as an "old" coupe, well...

I went to pick up my daughter tonight in the 968 and there was an "old" MGB cab at the stop light. He was foolish enough to temp me by revving his engine (well what passes as an engine), but there was still a certain "charm" to that car because it was a cab! I always tell my daughter how lucky she is to get to ride in Porsche at 13 on a regular basis! And a "cool" cabriolet to boot!

[94SilverCab]

If 968s are holding their value during a very tough reccession then it is like money in the bank. "Flat" is the new "Growth"...

Regards,

Jay

[jeff968]

Interesting stuff but I have to disagree with you on the coupe vs cab value. All things being equal, the cab will sell for 10-20% more. "As the top goes down, the value goes up." You should do a graph on tips vs 6spds.

[Fox944]

I may be wrong about this Dan, but i think the Cabs actually cost more to build. All cars came with a roof, the roof was then chopped off to create the cabs.

[94SilverCab]

Looks to me like the Coupe vs. Cab lines cross and now we can expect to see more higher priced cabs than coupes'

I would also guess that Cabs average lower mileage and better condition than coupes because they are more frequently used as "toys".

JMHO,

Jay

[flash]

yes, they were all hardtops to begin with, and were then modified to become cabs

cabs do tend to be lower mileage, as indicated, largely because they tend to be more "toys" than commuters

condition depends on the owner - cab interiors tend to be in worse shape earlier than hardtop interiors, due to more exposure to the sun

[ds968]

Clearly you guys realize I'm joking about cabs, but I'm pretty certain they do cost more than coupes to make - I think it's the reinforcements for body rigidity and all that which factors in . I'll also agree that cabs have more "charm" AND they are more timeless in the sense that they could pass for a 2010 model Porsche ( ok, except the pop up lights which are a giveaway )
whereas coupes are a bit more dated.. but not by much, especially since in the last year or two, damn near half of the sports cars out there are coming out with hatchbacks. Yeah, baby !!

Ok, all that cab love tribute aside, I still would not drive one or much less pay more for one than I would for a coupe. Different strokes..

[flash]

that's only because it takes you an hour to get your hair right before you leave the house, and you don't want to mess that up

[DaveN]

I too would be interested in a tip/6-speed comparison. I think that would explain some of the closeness in the charts for the cab/coupe and a few of the lower end prices.
I would buy a cab for 15K+ but if it was a tip you would have to discount it to sell it to my ilk. I am still of the mindset that a sports car IS a manual, heal and toe or no go - call me old (fashioned)